Last chance

Young team returns in 2018-2019 with tons of promise. Can they get back to the NCAA Tournament?
toddcudd
Posts: 41
Joined: Mon Apr 30, 2018 1:30 pm
Contact:

Last chance

Post by toddcudd » Tue Jun 16, 2020 8:33 pm

Have a decent season this year, or fold the program. We're now a d-league for better conferences. The rats have been leaving the sinking ship for years now.
We can't split divisions on sports, right? So I guess wrasslin' and lax stay d1, and we go club for other sports?
Or you guys good with D2 across the board?


Sundayamqb
Posts: 676
Joined: Mon May 07, 2018 10:42 am
Contact:

Re: Last chance

Post by Sundayamqb » Tue Jun 16, 2020 9:12 pm

The PL ought to drop to D-III for football and basketball, at least, and compete against other top academic institutions, including for national titles.

Time is running out to show Division I makes sense for anything but wrestling and maybe lax.
User avatar
van
Posts: 767
Joined: Mon May 07, 2018 1:49 pm
Location: KY
Contact:

Re: Last chance

Post by van » Tue Jun 16, 2020 10:19 pm

Sundayamqb wrote: Tue Jun 16, 2020 9:12 pm The PL ought to drop to D-III for football and basketball, at least, and compete against other top academic institutions, including for national titles.

Time is running out to show Division I makes sense for anything but wrestling and maybe lax.
While LAX has been pretty strong over the past 10 years or so, the power schools are now ramping their LAX programs, if your desire is to compete for national team championships, that dog don't hunt. Even wrestling, which no doubt has the most alumni support, a national team tittle is beyond wishful thinking.
User avatar
jimk72
Posts: 586
Joined: Tue May 08, 2018 6:39 am
Location: Allentown, Pa.
Contact:

Re: Last chance

Post by jimk72 » Wed Jun 17, 2020 6:53 am

This thread deserves a longer response and I don't have the time now. But in what year after 1950 did Lehigh ever have winning a national championship in a division One sport as a goal, with the obvious exception of wrestling? We have never had that as a goal. And being in Division 1 under these circumstances is fine with me. With the exception of football I think we are right were we should be. Unless you want to change the academic profile of our athletic programs, switch leagues, and find several billionaire donors........
Sundayamqb
Posts: 676
Joined: Mon May 07, 2018 10:42 am
Contact:

Re: Last chance

Post by Sundayamqb » Wed Jun 17, 2020 11:29 pm

I do not know what the Athletics Department's competitive mission is for its programs.

I do know that the investment in DI programs today is significantly higher than what it was in 1980, about when football entered I-AA.

If the competitive mission is win PL championships, staying put makes sense.

And what is the PL goal? To keep auto-bids to national championships? To have a team that wins a playoff game? Every year our little academic institutions face greater challenges from far better-fueled conferences and teams -- most with lower academic standards.

Clearly, though, the wrestling team has higher aspirations -- at least on an individual basis.

What's the cost-benefit analysis of Lehigh staying DI (including marketing value)? I'd like to see one that's done independently.
TMH
Posts: 2076
Joined: Mon May 07, 2018 2:35 pm
Contact:

Re: Last chance

Post by TMH » Thu Jun 18, 2020 12:55 pm

Sundayamqb wrote: Wed Jun 17, 2020 11:29 pm I do not know what the Athletics Department's competitive mission is for its programs.

I do know that the investment in DI programs today is significantly higher than what it was in 1980, about when football entered I-AA.

If the competitive mission is win PL championships, staying put makes sense.

And what is the PL goal? To keep auto-bids to national championships? To have a team that wins a playoff game? Every year our little academic institutions face greater challenges from far better-fueled conferences and teams -- most with lower academic standards.

Clearly, though, the wrestling team has higher aspirations -- at least on an individual basis.

What's the cost-benefit analysis of Lehigh staying DI (including marketing value)? I'd like to see one that's done independently.

Your analysis, although formed as questions, is pretty much spot on from my conversations. Our goal athletically is pretty much as stated to win the PL and give our student athletes the opportunity to compete against some of the best this country has to offer. Periodically we catch lightening in a bottle.

I'm fairly sure that the goal of the University is primarily to attract the best and the brightest HS students in the country. Just like in athletics, we may never fully compete with the Harvards, Princetons and Stanfords there but that doesn't mean we should relegate ourselves to a liberal arts college status to compete against Bowdoin and Williams instead. Its' competing against the best that makes us better.

Ironically, many of the best and brightest students at Lehigh are also high caliber athletes who manage to balance the demands of both rigorous academics and athletics. To me that is a recipe for success in the future
User avatar
van
Posts: 767
Joined: Mon May 07, 2018 1:49 pm
Location: KY
Contact:

Re: Last chance

Post by van » Thu Jun 18, 2020 1:57 pm

TMH wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 12:55 pm
Sundayamqb wrote: Wed Jun 17, 2020 11:29 pm I do not know what the Athletics Department's competitive mission is for its programs.

I do know that the investment in DI programs today is significantly higher than what it was in 1980, about when football entered I-AA.

If the competitive mission is win PL championships, staying put makes sense.

And what is the PL goal? To keep auto-bids to national championships? To have a team that wins a playoff game? Every year our little academic institutions face greater challenges from far better-fueled conferences and teams -- most with lower academic standards.

Clearly, though, the wrestling team has higher aspirations -- at least on an individual basis.

What's the cost-benefit analysis of Lehigh staying DI (including marketing value)? I'd like to see one that's done independently.

Ironically, many of the best and brightest students at Lehigh are also high caliber athletes who manage to balance the demands of both rigorous academics and athletics. To me that is a recipe for success in the future
I always find this amazing, and somewhat humbling
User avatar
RichH
Posts: 3904
Joined: Mon Apr 30, 2018 5:53 pm
Contact:

Re: Last chance

Post by RichH » Thu Jun 18, 2020 5:18 pm

TMH wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 12:55 pm
Sundayamqb wrote: Wed Jun 17, 2020 11:29 pm I do not know what the Athletics Department's competitive mission is for its programs.

I do know that the investment in DI programs today is significantly higher than what it was in 1980, about when football entered I-AA.

If the competitive mission is win PL championships, staying put makes sense.

And what is the PL goal? To keep auto-bids to national championships? To have a team that wins a playoff game? Every year our little academic institutions face greater challenges from far better-fueled conferences and teams -- most with lower academic standards.

Clearly, though, the wrestling team has higher aspirations -- at least on an individual basis.

What's the cost-benefit analysis of Lehigh staying DI (including marketing value)? I'd like to see one that's done independently.

Your analysis, although formed as questions, is pretty much spot on from my conversations. Our goal athletically is pretty much as stated to win the PL and give our student athletes the opportunity to compete against some of the best this country has to offer. Periodically we catch lightening in a bottle.

I'm fairly sure that the goal of the University is primarily to attract the best and the brightest HS students in the country. Just like in athletics, we may never fully compete with the Harvards, Princetons and Stanfords there but that doesn't mean we should relegate ourselves to a liberal arts college status to compete against Bowdoin and Williams instead. Its' competing against the best that makes us better.

Ironically, many of the best and brightest students at Lehigh are also high caliber athletes who manage to balance the demands of both rigorous academics and athletics. To me that is a recipe for success in the future
+1
toddcudd
Posts: 41
Joined: Mon Apr 30, 2018 1:30 pm
Contact:

Re: Last chance

Post by toddcudd » Thu Jun 18, 2020 8:29 pm

What has become abundantly clear is that competing - not "competing" - at the D1 level requires big $$. I don't see our BOD committing that kind of $$. No judgment on that - might well be the right decision. But, if so, why fake it?
TMH
Posts: 2076
Joined: Mon May 07, 2018 2:35 pm
Contact:

Re: Last chance

Post by TMH » Fri Jun 19, 2020 3:29 pm

If your goal is simply to win National Championships...you are absolutely correct that we will never overtake the "athletic factories". That isn't the goal though and nor it should be. Maintaining the academic integrity of the University is and should be the #1 goal. Winning the Patriot League should be our goal. Playing David against some Goliaths is a welcome bi-product. Lehigh's soccer team this year played 3 Big 10 teams with every advantage in the world. They beat Northwestern, Rutgers and lost in OT to Wisconsin. The opportunity to play in front of some large crowds should be a bonus, complete with big pay days eg Women's basketball vs UConn or Notre Dame. The immense exposure of playing in the NCAA Basketball Tournament is a huge bonus. Beating Duke is enormous. Luring the best and brightest to Lehigh though is the goal.
Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 27 guests