Line-up questions

Talk about the champions, or the Top 25 nationally-ranked team!
NothingMeaningful
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Re: Line-up questions

Post by NothingMeaningful » Thu Apr 16, 2020 10:38 am

jdalu75 wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 8:50 am
Loew's one of the guys I was thinking about. He has three years of eligibility remaining, just like Jonathon Fagen. Loew is 6' 3" according to Cornell's roster, so he's not moving down to 174 (occupied by Foca, Reiniche, Berreyesa, with Gage McClenahan probably headed for FLRTC). Dean has two years remaining. Darmstadt has two years remaining. Cardenas (IM #12) has four years remaining. Ethan Hatcher (IM #44, a 220-pounder projected at 197 in college) is probably headed for FLRTC.

Cornell's depth isn't great at the upper weights, so Loew will probably be the first guy up at 184 and the second guy up at 197 in the event of illness or injury.
I think it is important to remember that wrestling isn't the only (or sometimes the main) reason some of these guys go to Cornell, knowing that they likely won't be starters. Loew knew beforehand that Dean and Darmstadt would be standing in his way for a couple of years (of course he didn't know that Dean would ORS and give him the opportunity to start this year). Yes, he'd be starting on most of the other EIWA teams, but which schools would he have gotten into that would have given him an equivalent education/degree to one from Cornell? Same for Santoro, Lajoie, Seth Janney (2X National Prep champion), etc. These guys get to wrestle in a great room with national-caliber teammates, see some action, and come out the other end with an Ivy degree. That's why you don't see Cornell wrestlers dropping out or transferring (with exceptions, of course).

This calculation may change for guys like Cardenas at 197, who likely expected to be a starter for three years, but Darmstadt's injury means he might get only two years. Maybe he thinks he can beat Darmstadt, or maybe he's okay with being behind for two years. Maybe he thinks he can be a 4x AA somewhere else. Hatcher doesn't have a place this year either at 197 or at 285 (Fernandes), or likely for most of his career. But he knows that.

As for depth not being great at the upper weights, I'd think that Darmstadt/Cardenas at 197 and Fernandes/Furman at 285 is pretty good.


mookie
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Re: Line-up questions

Post by mookie » Thu Apr 16, 2020 12:35 pm

Cornell has a for real heavyweight in Lewis Fernandes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=98mJ5YSOKKs&t=7s
legger
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Re: Line-up questions

Post by legger » Thu Apr 16, 2020 5:13 pm

**** Fernandes looks like he wrestles like Josh Humphries in this video. He likes to ride high and use arm bars and traps. I also saw him on a Youtube video against the Harvard Hwt., who placed 2nd at the EIWAs. Fernandes took him down and then pinned him in about 2 minutes. He looks pretty darn good.
jdalu75
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Re: Line-up questions

Post by jdalu75 » Thu Apr 16, 2020 5:34 pm

NothingMeaningful wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 10:38 am

As for depth not being great at the upper weights, I'd think that Darmstadt/Cardenas at 197 and Fernandes/Furman at 285 is pretty good.
Getting better but at times in recent years they've been woefully thin, much like their situation at 125. LaJoie was the only Cornell wrestler who competed at 125 this year. Last year Max Dean covered 184, Ben Honis covered 197, the only wrestler they had to back up at either weight was Jake Taylor. Womack and Berreyesa were their only 174s, then Berreyesa was needed at 165.

I was referring specifically to 184/197, where the team pretty much has Dean at 184 and Darmstadt and Cardenas at 197. Loew's a ways back, will be a backup unless there's an injury or two.

As far as guys not transferring out -- Caleb Richardson, Alex Cisneros, Dalton Macri, and Gerard Angelo all went elsewhere.
NothingMeaningful
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Re: Line-up questions

Post by NothingMeaningful » Thu Apr 16, 2020 6:18 pm

jdalu75 wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 5:34 pm
NothingMeaningful wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 10:38 am

As for depth not being great at the upper weights, I'd think that Darmstadt/Cardenas at 197 and Fernandes/Furman at 285 is pretty good.
Getting better but at times in recent years they've been woefully thin, much like their situation at 125. LaJoie was the only Cornell wrestler who competed at 125 this year. Last year Max Dean covered 184, Ben Honis covered 197, the only wrestler they had to back up at either weight was Jake Taylor. Womack and Berreyesa were their only 174s, then Berreyesa was needed at 165.

I was referring specifically to 184/197, where the team pretty much has Dean at 184 and Darmstadt and Cardenas at 197. Loew's a ways back, will be a backup unless there's an injury or two.

As far as guys not transferring out -- Caleb Richardson, Alex Cisneros, Dalton Macri, and Gerard Angelo all went elsewhere.
Richardson and Angelo never matriculated at Cornell, right? Cisneros didn't transfer because of wrestling, did he? He was involved in some shady dealings, it seems. Did he ever wrestle again?

In any case, there aren't many examples of guys leaving Cornell's program.
whiz wit
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Re: Line-up questions

Post by whiz wit » Thu Apr 16, 2020 6:35 pm

NM,

Aren't you forgetting about Len Crol?
jdalu75
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Re: Line-up questions

Post by jdalu75 » Thu Apr 16, 2020 6:59 pm

NothingMeaningful wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 6:18 pm

Richardson and Angelo never matriculated at Cornell, right?
So? They both committed to Cornell, both did a year at FL, both had an entrenched lineup ahead of them on the depth chart. Both went elsewhere to wrestle.

You wrote: "That's why you don't see Cornell wrestlers dropping out or transferring (with exceptions, of course)." Cisneros dropped out. Now you're imposing conditions?
NothingMeaningful
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Re: Line-up questions

Post by NothingMeaningful » Thu Apr 16, 2020 8:17 pm

jdalu75 wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 6:59 pm
NothingMeaningful wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 6:18 pm

Richardson and Angelo never matriculated at Cornell, right?
So? They both committed to Cornell, both did a year at FL, both had an entrenched lineup ahead of them on the depth chart. Both went elsewhere to wrestle.

You wrote: "That's why you don't see Cornell wrestlers dropping out or transferring (with exceptions, of course)." Cisneros dropped out. Now you're imposing conditions?
What part of "with exceptions, of course" was not clear? And what part of "Cornell wrestlers" wasn't a condition that those who never matriculated at Cornell didn't meet? How do you drop out or transfer out of Cornell if you never were at Cornell in the first place?
D3 for LU
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Re: Line-up questions

Post by D3 for LU » Fri Apr 17, 2020 5:43 am

Are you two actually lawyers? :P
(... or only play them on TV? ;) )

D3
Last edited by D3 for LU on Fri Apr 17, 2020 10:05 am, edited 1 time in total.
Mountain Hawk
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Re: Line-up questions

Post by Mountain Hawk » Fri Apr 17, 2020 7:32 am

Nothing Meaningful username checks out
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