NDSU- A whole other league

Back-to-back PL champs 2016 and 2017.... but need to get back to relevance in the national FCS scene.
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Marco
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NDSU- A whole other league

Post by Marco » Sat Dec 08, 2018 7:40 pm

Congrats to Colgate for getting into the FCS playoffs, being seeded, and reaching the quarter final round. Like Lehigh's 2011 team, the season ended with a shut out thud in Fargo.

Watching that game, I kept thinking that NDSU could probably defeat many FBS teams. They redshirt their freshmen, have relaxed admissions, and grant full scholarships. The distance between them and most other FCS teams (especially the Patriot League) is like a vast chasm.


Sundayamqb
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Re: NDSU- A whole other league

Post by Sundayamqb » Sat Dec 08, 2018 8:31 pm

It's ridiculous.

NDSU blew out a team that lost to BCS #23 Army, 28-14. My guess is NDSU is a top 20 BCS team.

Why not require dominant FCS teams with dynasties to go to BCS and vice versa: relegation and promotion.

The different rules on scholarships, etc., make FCS unfair.
ngineer
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Re: NDSU- A whole other league

Post by ngineer » Sat Dec 08, 2018 11:12 pm

Other schools/leagues have different values on athletics. Football "out there" is such a community based matter it is a serious governmental program for the financial and mental health of Fargo and vicinity. There is little else for the populace to rally around or be distracted by. No pro-teams battling for attention or their dollars, no FBS schools doing the same. They have great pride in their program and it gives them national attention. They have found a niche and truly excel. We don't have to play in the same sandbox as them. But, my sense is that we like challenges like that. It is what make the PL schools special because, unlike the IL, we are willing to step up to the challenge of playing the 'big boys' knowing the odds are against us, but that experiencing the challenge and the enjoying the trip is what life is all about. We find out in real world that many people do not play by the same rules. So, we either deal with it, or go home. I think that is what makes a school like Lehigh so special.
Go Lehigh TU Owl
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Re: NDSU- A whole other league

Post by Go Lehigh TU Owl » Sun Dec 09, 2018 12:16 am

North Dakota State would contend in the AAC. 8-4 Temple managed to lose to Villanova this year. I don't want any part of that High Plain nonsense! They should be moving to the Mountain West Conference at this point! Their program is simply operating at a Top 30 FBS level within FCS.

Even the truly great programs historically, Georgia Southern, Montana, Youngstown State, Marshall, App State etc. never had anything like this. App State's 3 peat was amazing no question. But they never won one before that title run and afterwards their level of play fell off pretty quickly before moving to FBS. They actually ran their long-time coach, Jerry Moore, out of Boone.

A great program like Delaware has 1 national title. And it came against Colgate! Montana "only" has two. Same as Marshall. The Thundering Herd needed a stacked deck in '96 (final year in 1-AA) just to get a second one. 1-AA/FCS has always had their powers and great teams but there's always been a chance for teams to rise up and have a shot. NDSU has eliminated hope for everyone except JMU this decade! Villanova and Richmond are lucky they got theirs in 2008 and 2009! Without the Bison think of all the different possibilities? Where does Lehigh end up in 2011? Does Towson, YES Towson, snag a national title? Colgate make it to Frisco this year? Colgate could hang with 3 out of the 4 semifinalist; Maine, EWU, and South Dakota State. Those three are destined for the same fate as Colgate.

At this point the Bison fans are begging for fellow MVFC'er SDSU to provide some competition. It's not going to happen.
Last edited by Go Lehigh TU Owl on Sun Dec 09, 2018 1:09 am, edited 3 times in total.
Go Lehigh TU Owl
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Re: NDSU- A whole other league

Post by Go Lehigh TU Owl » Sun Dec 09, 2018 1:03 am

ngineer wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 11:12 pm
Other schools/leagues have different values on athletics. Football "out there" is such a community based matter it is a serious governmental program for the financial and mental health of Fargo and vicinity. There is little else for the populace to rally around or be distracted by. No pro-teams battling for attention or their dollars, no FBS schools doing the same. They have great pride in their program and it gives them national attention. They have found a niche and truly excel. We don't have to play in the same sandbox as them. But, my sense is that we like challenges like that. It is what make the PL schools special because, unlike the IL, we are willing to step up to the challenge of playing the 'big boys' knowing the odds are against us, but that experiencing the challenge and the enjoying the trip is what life is all about. We find out in real world that many people do not play by the same rules. So, we either deal with it, or go home. I think that is what makes a school like Lehigh so special.
It's just that North Dakota State is at another level. There's no real football factories in FCS outside of Fargo, ND. I spent time in Montana which gave me the chance to learn quite a bit about those programs. They're not pulling in ringers and stacking the deck. Those Top 5 Montana State teams under Ash were no better than Lehigh at the time. Last week the poor Bobcats got run out of the Fargo Dome worse than Colgate.

Lehigh and Colgate's ideology and ceiling in general are no different than the Maine's, Weber State's, Jacksonville State's, Sam Houston State, Wofford's, Delaware's, Villanova's Northern Iowa's etc of the world when it comes to FCS football. The "power conference" schools might be admitting different kids, get more transfers etc but at the end of the day they're working their butts off and ending up in the same place as the top PL programs. EWU, SDSU and JMU seem to be the "other" elite programs. But even those teams look very mortal the more you watch. Certainly nothing like NDSU. The Eagles, Bunnies and Dukes have a combined 3 national titles. And if it wasn't for 7 downs they might have a grand total of 2. NDSU has 6 in the last 7 years! It's ridiculous....

Colgate went 3-0 against the CAA this year. The Raiders are the first PL program in the playoff era to win 3 games in one season against the A10/CAA! Until NDSU leaves or crumbles worry about getting CAA and IL scalps and win the league. Those goals are well within reason and should keep Lehigh fans engaged.

The Colgate faithful came out in force last weekend against JMU. I think the announced attendance was over 6k which is nothing to be ashamed of. I would like to think a playoff game at Lehigh (closer to JMU's alumni base so more Duke fans) would sniff 10k.
ngineer
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Re: NDSU- A whole other league

Post by ngineer » Wed Dec 12, 2018 1:06 pm

Go Lehigh TU Owl wrote:
Sun Dec 09, 2018 1:03 am
ngineer wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 11:12 pm
Other schools/leagues have different values on athletics. Football "out there" is such a community based matter it is a serious governmental program for the financial and mental health of Fargo and vicinity. There is little else for the populace to rally around or be distracted by. No pro-teams battling for attention or their dollars, no FBS schools doing the same. They have great pride in their program and it gives them national attention. They have found a niche and truly excel. We don't have to play in the same sandbox as them. But, my sense is that we like challenges like that. It is what make the PL schools special because, unlike the IL, we are willing to step up to the challenge of playing the 'big boys' knowing the odds are against us, but that experiencing the challenge and the enjoying the trip is what life is all about. We find out in real world that many people do not play by the same rules. So, we either deal with it, or go home. I think that is what makes a school like Lehigh so special.
It's just that North Dakota State is at another level. There's no real football factories in FCS outside of Fargo, ND. I spent time in Montana which gave me the chance to learn quite a bit about those programs. They're not pulling in ringers and stacking the deck. Those Top 5 Montana State teams under Ash were no better than Lehigh at the time. Last week the poor Bobcats got run out of the Fargo Dome worse than Colgate.

Lehigh and Colgate's ideology and ceiling in general are no different than the Maine's, Weber State's, Jacksonville State's, Sam Houston State, Wofford's, Delaware's, Villanova's Northern Iowa's etc of the world when it comes to FCS football. The "power conference" schools might be admitting different kids, get more transfers etc but at the end of the day they're working their butts off and ending up in the same place as the top PL programs. EWU, SDSU and JMU seem to be the "other" elite programs. But even those teams look very mortal the more you watch. Certainly nothing like NDSU. The Eagles, Bunnies and Dukes have a combined 3 national titles. And if it wasn't for 7 downs they might have a grand total of 2. NDSU has 6 in the last 7 years! It's ridiculous....

Colgate went 3-0 against the CAA this year. The Raiders are the first PL program in the playoff era to win 3 games in one season against the A10/CAA! Until NDSU leaves or crumbles worry about getting CAA and IL scalps and win the league. Those goals are well within reason and should keep Lehigh fans engaged.

The Colgate faithful came out in force last weekend against JMU. I think the announced attendance was over 6k which is nothing to be ashamed of. I would like to think a playoff game at Lehigh (closer to JMU's alumni base so more Duke fans) would sniff 10k.
Only if not on the weekend of Thanksgiving. I remember the JMU game of 2004 and doubt we had more than 6-7,000. Another weekend, I think you're right. Colgate's turnout was the best I've seen in many years up there. Hell, we almost outnumber them when we go up there!
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